A few weeks ago in my English 98 class I was trying to point out that The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe presents a very contrastive example of war and revenge than Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone. In Lewis' work, the children are motivated by love of Mr. Tumnus, the desire to right wrong, to save their brother from the evil White Witch, and ultimately to serve Aslan. They then pursue these goals constrained by the laws of Narnia, as Aslan himself does when he submits to the "Deep Magic" and sacrifices himself on the Stone Table.
In Harry Potter, though Harry's motives are arguably "good" in the sense he is trying to help his friends (Neville or Hagrid), he still consistently breaks the rules to do so (flying on his broom when he's been told not to or breaking into the tower at night), and receives either no punishment or reward (flying on the broom = becoming a Seeker). Thus personal revenge and "taking the law into your own hands" are lauded while submitting to authority (try to find a good, staunch authority figure in HP, by the way), is typically mocked or subverted.
In response to this, one of my students argued that the children in TLWW are seeking revenge - they want revenge upon the White Witch for what she has done to Tumnus, Aslan, and Edmund. I tried to explain that not every 'fight for justice' is an act of revenge - they are not personally going after the Witch to kill her, but operating within an epic war pitting the clearly good side against the evil one. This then got us into the root cause of War.
My students pretty universally agreed that all War is caused by some sort of revenge - revenge for taking land, deposing a King, etc. But I'm hesitant to apply revenge, which I would define as being a personal, vindictive act outside of the law of the land, to every War.
This also seems to eliminate the idea of Divine wrath or judgement - a "just war" in the sense of the battle against Evil, or Christ's defeat of Satan, or the ultimate war of God and His angels against Satan and his dark forces. Does anyone else agree? If a war is sanctioned by God - if it is rooted in Good against Evil - can it have any taint of revenge? Does God ever seek "revenge" on someone? Being vengeful obviously isn't the same thing, but I'm looking for some extra clarity.
8 comments:
I completely agree with you! Think about the war of Independence. Were we (Americans) seeking revenge upon England? Or England seeking revenge on us. No, it was our fight for freedom and England fight to maintain control. The Civil War is the same story. Who was seeking revenge on who? And then in the final battle God and His angels against Satan. Is God taking revenge upon Satan? Also, most of the battles in the old testament that God had ordained were not about revenge but rather served as a reminder to the Israelites to put their trust in God and not on their idols. It makes no sense that God would take revenge or have that be His motive when it is He who has planned it from the beginning.
Careful Bekah, your starting to sound kind of like a historian.
I agree with you too, sweetheart. Many wars have been about revenge and many personal vendettas have been carried out in the name of war, but the issue you are running up against is that many of your students do not see an absolute evil or good; there is not absolute standard of right or wrong. So of course it is going to be all about themselves and a personal emotion. As long as they look at history from a subjective and selfish view point they will never be able to see the greater picture. The picture that it is His story and God is sovereign and uses many nations to hold fight and hold back evil in this world.
God is the avenger of evil, but His is fully righteous and holy. We have no right to compare our human vengeance to God's perfection.
Good thoughts, please keep up the posts.
sorry about my dumb errors
Well, I think James the brother of Jesus has some great thoughts: "What is the source of quarrels and conflicts among you? Is not the source your pleasures that wage war in your members? You lust and do not have; so you commit murder. You are envious and cannot obtain; so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask. You ask and do not receive because you ask with wrong motives, so that you may spend it on your pleasures."
So, the source of war is the selfishness within us. Perhaps it is revenge, but perhaps it is lust or something else. I find it hard to believe all of Hitler's aggression was based on revenge.
I hope that helps in some way!
What can I say Andy.....social science class were the ones that I excelled in....I am a historian at heart!!
Curtis - that's a great verse, thank you! I suppose the root of War will always be Sin, be it between Satan and God or various peoples, and that relates to revenge. But then...can it be the cause and not the motive? Or perhaps God fighting evil is entirely different.
"perhaps God fighting evil is entirely different."
I have always thought God fighting evil is righteousness. I have never thought of it as God taking revenge ( I assume it would be on Satan) for sin and the fall. After all, God planned for the fall.
I would lean towards revenge being a human response between people on the same level. God is our Master and Lord. If I sin against Him, it is not revenge for Him to correct me. It is loving discipline. For the unbeliever who disobeys, His response seems to be a righteous judgment but not revenge.
You asked if revenge could be a cause for war. It seems to me that they are close to the same. Motives seem to be more personal. So can war result from personal revenge? I would think so. It might be tougher to prove since it is something residing in the heart.
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